White Gloves and Black Purses
September 18th, 2007
The Rich Legacy of Mother-Daughter Relationships
The other day, Verna Daisy and I sat at her expertly polished kitchen table, sipping Earl Gray tea from dainty porcelain cups. As we conversed, I picked up two sugar cubes, one at a time, with a pair of silver tongs and gently dropped them in my tea, mindful not to cause a splash. I don’t remember exactly what Miss Verna Daisy and I spoke about, but I do know we used proper speech, crossed our legs at the ankles, and put crisply folded linen napkins on our laps.
It was quite a different experience when I took Yetta out to lunch. After the salads were served, Yetta secreted a small plastic bag from her oversized black purse. It appeared to be empty at first, but suddenly I saw a small black dot fall between a romaine leaf and red radish. Before you could say “free lunch”, Yetta was calling for the waiter, indignantly pointing to the dead fly and demanding a manager. Not only was our lunch free, but Yetta also negotiated a $20 coupon for a return visit. I squirmed in the booth, eating my complimentary Reuben, while Yetta enthusiastically schooled me on the fine art of the trip & fall, the splash-and-cash cases that were almost always settled out of court.
I love other people’s mothers. I love to hear my friends tell their stories of growing up, and of the women who helped shape them. There’s just something very special about mother-daughter relationships, even the challenging ones, that I missed while growing up. It’s not about the etiquette lessons or the squirming embarrassments, really – it’s about the richness of experiences that women bestow upon their daughters.
I never actually met Verna Daisy or Yetta, but I visualize them through my friend’s tales, and being a writer I naturally weave them into my own imagination. Like every colorful person I have met, in person or in tales, they become part of my psyche, vibrant characters that spark the art of story.
As I spoke with Verna Daisy’s daughter today, I recalled other mothers from my youth. My friend Kathy’s mother – a stunningly beautiful woman who used to surprise her daughter on occasion by leaving new clothes at the foot of her bed. Kathy, as I recall, was not nearly as delighted as I was by the shopping excursions, having gotten used to them, but I remember thinking that when I had a daughter of my own I would do for her what Mrs. Quinn did for Kathy, and I did. Fortunately, Elisabeth was always excited about getting new clothes.
Then there was Mrs. Hawkins, a divorced Mormon mother of six, and a University professor. Her house was always overrun with school books and papers, and there was almost always a pan of Rice Krispie treats in the kitchen. Her daughter, my best friend Carol, taught me gymnastics in the front yard of her house, and Carol’s oldest sister Betty taught me to play “Colour My World” on the piano. All of Mrs. Hawkins’ children were friendly, smart, and generous. I remember being surprised when Carol told me there were only four rules in her house. Kindness, Respect, Care and Consideration. I adopted the same four rules in my house when I became a mother, and found them to be wonderfully simple and successful.
Besides the mothers I knew, there were also ones I met only briefly but found something admirable about. They were usually small things, such as the way they ruffled their child’s hair when they knew a good-bye kiss would have brought teasing, or the way they comforted their daughters after a lost softball game.
As a girl, I learned something, and took something to heart, from all of the mothers surrounding me. I learned, in pieces, to become the whole mother I wanted to be. These women may have never known it, but they were teaching another woman’s child what it took to be a good parent – to be, as consistently as one can, warm, firm, fair, loving, gentle and patient.
Even now that I am grown, I find myself drawn to learn – and to laughter – from the mothers I didn’t meet, but who left their daughters with so many wonderfully rich memories.
I can see Verna Daisy in my mind’s eye, shaking her well-coiffed head at the antics of her stubborn, devil-may-care daughter, and I imagine that inside she was rather proud to have raised a strong, spirited woman who had a mind of her own and who acted independently of “what the neighbors might think.” My friend might appreciate the Mark Twain quote, “My mother had a great deal of trouble with me, but I think she enjoyed it.” Verna Daisy, always the proper lady right down to the white gloves and perfectly applied lipstick, may have reared a rebel, but she’s a well-mannered rebel who keeps her elbows off the table and drinks her beer from a glass – at least when she’s in public.
Upon the always-intractable Yetta’s death, her children found two uncashed checks from legal settlements among their mother’s belongings and a claim to a class action suit. Amidst the heartache of her passing, and years of bittersweet memories my friend couldn’t help but relay this story with a bit of laughter. Sure, Yetta wore a bikini and party hat to her teen daughter’s birthday party, was bored by every city she lived in, and sued just about anybody she could –but that was Yetta, for better or worse.
Even when we took in lessons of what we didn’t wish to emulate in our adult years – when we didn’t, for example, subscribe to the notion that wearing a hat inside the house signaled the end of civilized society, or that sticking twenty sugar packets from McDonald’s in our purse was really appropriate payback for that nickel increase in the price of a cheeseburger – we learned something about ourselves. The individual ideas and beliefs we began forming as children became clearer and more defined when we watched the women around us in all their human glory – when we not only wanted to imitate their best qualities, but questioned their lesser ones.
Verna Daisy is no doubt in Heaven now, wearing the whitest of wings, the shiniest of halos, and an immaculate well-pressed gown. Yetta is probably up there, too, taking notes on the layout, searching for the perfect cloud to trip over, and planning her next move.
The legacies of mothers who have passed are carried into the present by the children they leave behind, not just their own but all those they came in contact with. Their characters live on not just in individual memory, but in stories passed from one generation, one family, and even one friend to the next. God could not be everywhere, the proverb says, so he created mothers. And in a way, through the richness of experiences they offered on earth, I believe every mother shares God’s immortal spirit.
48 Responses to “White Gloves and Black Purses”
Freida September 18th, 2007 at 2:45 am #
Dear Jane,
I used to think I was a practical person. When I was seven years old, I felt more like seventy.
You blow me away; exactly where I want to go, inside my imagination, when I read your words, a little magic happens.
And, I want to read what you wrote, again and again.
What a wonderfully, brilliant ‘picture’ you paint with your combination of words.
The ‘color’ the ‘hue’ the ‘tint’ … with a simple palette consisting of only 27 letters.
However, I need to analyze, all this and put all those pieces together…in different ways…and visualize and rationalize and have a lot of fun in doing that.
Guess I’m pretty strange, right?
Not at all.
I’m just plain simple and so, ordinary…that’s why I need so much to fly away.
And, enjoy the soaring.
Love,
Freida
QV September 18th, 2007 at 10:00 am #
I wish this blog theme had one of those little animated smilies laying on its back laughing and rolling and kicking its feet. That was a really cute story Jane.
I believe that Mothers have the ability to make us or break us in some respects. I also feel that we can learn from their mistakes. I certainly did.
Barbara September 18th, 2007 at 12:07 pm #
From Anna Nicole Smith to Terry Armstrong, to Verna and Yetta….Jane, you just have such a way of making the lives of these women soar off the pages and into the hearts of your readers.
I enjoyed this article so much, and found myself laughing especially at the sugar packets. My mother does that. She also does that with all the little packets of condiments and hand wipes. I don’t think my mother has actually ever bought a full bottle of catsup, mustard or taco sauce! Too funny.
My MIL irons everything she can get her hands on, includings bed sheets. We all tease her about it, but even with the advent of nearly wrinkle-free cotton, she has never stopped Like her hairstyle, her ironing is a habit I’m sure will never change.
I learned so much though through both women, and love them dearly.
QV September 18th, 2007 at 9:29 pm #
Well you know Jane. To think back, I don’t think I was quite a teenager yet when Yetta pranced around our dining room table serving cake to my friends a la bikini. But I was sure as embarrassed as any teenager may have been.
Joni September 18th, 2007 at 11:22 pm #
Jane,
I’m glad you had these other mothers to learn things from. You learned very well. You are an admirable lady.
Joni September 18th, 2007 at 11:27 pm #
Also, talking about white gloves. I can remember wearing the little white gloves and also hats when I was still in my teens. That’s telling my age some lol. But you never went to church or anywhere else that you dressed up for, without the gloves and hats. Back then we weren’t even allowed to wear slacks or jeans to school. It was dresses or skirts only.
We were very poor, but my mother raised us well and dressed us well. She made most of our clothes and was an excellent seamstress, but never did it for a living. She was a fulltime mother.
A.P. September 19th, 2007 at 7:16 am #
I love the cute stories and the beautiful picture above. A good book about the mother/daughter dynamic is “You’re Wearing That - understanding mothers and daughters in conversation” by Deborah Tannen.
VIVIAN September 19th, 2007 at 9:02 am #
MY MOM, I WAS BORN, the last of 10[i was an oops baby] born when my mother was over 50 yrs old. she died at the age of 100 . i guess we were poor, but i guess we all were in those days. big mormon family, my father died , i never knew him. but my mom was the sweetest angel ever born, actually she and her 2 sister were out of the same mold. my mon was a hard worker, she worked cleaning house for 5.00 a day, she worked in the cannery in the summers. she got 137.00 a month for my fathers death benefits. never remarried, went to church every sunday, washed ironed cleaned to keep her family together. the saving grace was that there was only 4 of us at home. the rest were all old enough to be my mother or father. i would stay with them in the summers while my mom worked. but i always wanted to be with her. even cleaning a house i would go, and try and help, and she would send me to the store to get a 5cent 3muskeeteers bar. That is what we would split after she made me eat a p/b. sandwitch. we would sit at the table in the evenings, and listen to the mysterys and do jig saw puzzles. i would go get in her bed, and aske her questions, if there would be little children when god came back to the world. i rember how that used to bother me, untill she would explain how safe those children would be. before school started. we would take the bus and go to marysville, to ” monkey wards” and Pennys, and we would get school clothes NEW ONES. she always made sure we had good clothes. if she did not have enough money for all the things, she would charge them and pay 5.00 a month. nothing really stands out in my young mind as one thing, about my mom., just the every day life of living with her was enough for me. i miss her and i love her and i talk to her still. She was the first angel i ever knew.
mish September 19th, 2007 at 11:27 am #
I remember having matching orange sweater (mini skirts)dresses and white Go Go boots. I always begged to wear that outfit when we went on weekly shopping adventures. I was a mini me(as said by my mom). The exception was at that time I had Golden blonde hair with whispy curls. Now brown(natural)and the only whisp in sight is that of a touch of gray (which I have been meaning to cover up).
My parents divorced when I was very young and my dad had custody of us. I never seen my mother in those years, not that my father wouldnt allow it. He would encourage me to but because I was Daddy’s little girl i thought I would hurt him if I said I wanted too.
Not for many years later after I was married did I speak with her. My daddy had died and she called to give her condolences to me. It was a couple years later that I actually seen her. It was at the funeral of my Grandpa(her father). We connected right away. Since we have grown very close and I KNOW my daddy happy that my children have a grandparent that loves them and is there for them.
My mom has been very sick and there are times that we have the role reversal I am the one telling her what to do and she WILL do it. Her wedding has been moved a month and I will be her Matron of Honor a Honor that I am very proud to take on. Since she has been sick There are times I really miss her. I would always call her two or three times a day. Just to say hey……you know what happened. There was joke between us that I had a video survelance set up at her house because I would always call as she would walk in the door or when she was playing cards with her Fiance’. I miss those calls and I cant wait for them again, I cant burden her now with somethings and there are things I have wanted to tell her. She is and was my confidant. I miss our shopping trips( I would tire and she was still ready to chug along). Saying one more store……
Another woman is my husbands Grandmother her birthday is this weekend and she turns 101, Happy Birthday Grandma! This woman raised two sons and when they enlisted in the war(WW II) she enlisted right along with them. She had a rough life but she didnt let it get to her she made the best of it.
So heres to all the Moms, Grandmothers, Aunts, Daughters and Sisters out there You all Rock!!!
A.P. September 19th, 2007 at 1:59 pm #
Beautiful, touching stories!!! My mother and my grandmothers were a big influence on my parenting skills. They just made one feel special. They would make your favorite dishes, make plenty of cookies and sweets for your kids, stock up their pantries and refrigerator with your favorite drinks and snacks when you were visiting or spending the weekend. My mother was a very messy cook. In fact I have some of her recipe books with holiday favorites and the pages are stained and splattered,. but I cherish them.
I remember how my maternal grandmother and my mother always fussed about their hair. They would go to the hairdressers and come out with their hair coiffed identically the same- looking like a football helmet sitting on their head.
VIVIAN September 19th, 2007 at 2:18 pm #
I think i commented an other time, about our short term memory getting shorter, and our long term memory getting sharper. I think that is because of the fine memories, we had and they are there or us to grow old with. That is time time of our babies, and families growing together, good memoties that we have cherished so so long. a.p. when you mentioned hair, i rember my mom going to get a permanent. and she would sit in this chair with curlers hooked to somthing electerical i believe., but from the time i was 12 i cut my moms hair, amd my aunts. And i would put metal curlers in their hair, and they would do work untill their hair was dry,. i would then comb it and make it wave , and how pretty she and my aunt would look the next day at church. I still have a little heart candy box filled with my moms hair, probably more in the box than what was on her head when she died. and years later after my own children were out of high school, i went to beauty school, and i had my own shop for 18 years.
My mothers daughter September 19th, 2007 at 2:32 pm #
Jane it totally amazes me the way that you have captured the spirit and essence of my mother just from the few telephone conversations where she has been mentioned. I just wish that I had been part of that dream and knew what the two of you were discussing.
Until her final breath Verna Daisy was still trying to mold me into a miniature version of herself, still with no success. What she didn’t realize was that while we may not have originally agreed on many things we usually arrived at the same conclusion, just from different directions. I just hope that she realized how much she influenced my life and my life choices. We may have argued fiercely but we loved even more fiercely.
I was fortunate to grow up on a wonderful dead end street across from the local university in a small town where I learned from all the mothers on that street. Every house had an open door policy and from these women I learned what I wanted to be like and what I didn’t. This very diverse group of women helped shape me into the person I now am and I am eternally grateful to each and every one of them.
As an aside, Mum would be absolutely mortified that you mentioned that I drink the occasional beer, even when in the proper glass. She was the only person I knew that could make alcohol sound like a four letter word.
I recently read Mitch Albom’s book For One More Day and I would move heaven and earth and give up all my worldly possessions (except my dogs) to have that experience with my Mum. I also read his book The Five People You Meet in Heaven and I truly hope that my Mother is one of them.
I hope that Mum and Yetta are in Heaven watching down on both QV and myself with pride and have met each other and are comparing notes on their daughters.
Mish September 19th, 2007 at 4:10 pm #
Before I was a Mom I never tripped over toys or forgot words to a lullaby.
I didn’t worry whether or not my plants were poisonous.
I never thought about immunizations.
Before I was a Mom - I had never been puked on.
Pooped on.
Chewed on.
Peed on.
I had complete control of my mind and my thoughts.
I slept all night.
Before I was a Mom I never held down a screaming child so doctors could do tests.
Or give shots.
I never looked into teary eyes and cried.
I never got gloriously happy over a simple grin.
I never sat up late hours at night watching a baby sleep.
Before I was a Mom I never held a sleeping baby just because I didn’t want to put them down.
I never felt my heart break into a million pieces when I couldn’t stop the hurt.
I never knew that something so small could affect my life so much.
I never knew that I could love someone so much.
I never knew I would love being a Mom.
Before I was a Mom - I didn’t know the feeling of having my heart outside my body.
I didn’t know how special it could feel to feed a hungry baby.
I didn’t know that bond between a mother and her child.
I didn’t know that something so small could make me feel so important and happy.
Before I was a Mom - I had never gotten up in the middle of the night every 10 minutes to make sure all was okay.
I had never known the warmth, the joy, the love, the heartache, the wonderment or the satisfaction of being a Mom.
I didn’t know I was capable of feeling so much before I was a Mom.
(from http://www.lovethissite.com/mombefore/)
Barbara September 19th, 2007 at 4:49 pm #
Aha! The daughters of Verna Daisy and Yetta are right here! LOL. I loved that surprise…..
My Mother’s Daughter, your mom sounds like a hoot! I bet you had a wonderful time pretend-mortifying her! LOL. My paternal grandmother was a bit like Verna Daisy, a very proper ladylike lady, even after she was widowed and tending to things herself. She was appalled by the advent of the miniskirt! Especially an orange one, like AP had, with gogo boots! My sister and I loved to tease her and say oh yeah, Grandma, we got you one for Christmas….stuff like that. We teased her so much, about everything from music to our plans to join a commune……and it was a riot to get her going…..more so because she knew we were teasing and she really layed on the prim and proper act as much as we layed on the rebel 60’s act.
I was only 15 when she passed but I still remember the scent of lavendar sachets she kept in the dresser drawers….which kind of worked against the smell of the mothballs she kept in the closet.
Freida September 19th, 2007 at 10:28 pm #
Dear Jane,
Good for you, joining that commercial bandwagon.
You’re pretty darn smart, aren’t you…can’t beat ‘em…join ‘em.
It’s the only way to survive.
Be choosy, I like purses…and shoes.
Hate makeup, and perfumes…like scented candles though…the really expensive ones, although of course I only buy what’s on sale.
I want quality, not necessarily quantity…even though you know I love that math.
Food, shelter, clothing…moral support.
Practical stuff, like healing foods, and good words, and works.
Simple stuff, like pet combs that really work, natural remedies, homeopathic (sp?) medicine…like laughter, and good crying out loud.
Less plastic, and more real…
————————————-
Dear Jane,
Your site is sorta lookin’ like trash…sorry, but I’m looking for treasure.
Maybe, though, you will get more readership, taking this direction…and get the attention of girls, that need so very, much to read you.
Love Ya!
I do try so hard to understand. One of my bosses, used to own ‘Variety,’ well he wasn’t really my boss, he was my owner, my boss was ACTUALLY, just another employee!!!
That man, that owned ‘Variety,’ was such an honest gentleman, and I worked for another one of his many publications. He liked cars, not those assembly-line models, but the really special ones, the works of art and engineering…they once were.
———————————–
Well, Fredia, what can I say? You like math, right? 86 articles were written for this site. . . about 350 hours were spent writing, another 200 for research and phone calls. . .which translates to about 13.75 weeks of full time work — done for free — in the course of five months. The Google ads are hardly a moneymaker. I estimate I’ll earn about $10 a month from them, which will cover the monthly cost of hosting this domain. By the way, your entertainment news guru Art has Google ads on his site. . .yet no one has ever said a word about them. I’m neither beating or joining anyone. Just thought maybe I’d quit paying out of my own pocket to host the site. And p.s. to whoever reported my coffee fund to the IRS, thank you for the laugh, and for being a vigilant American. Too funny. - JD
MontanaMan September 19th, 2007 at 10:45 pm #
Scared me for a minute. Read this and thought maybe I forgot mother’s day.
:::::Wiping sweat from brow::::::
QV September 19th, 2007 at 10:59 pm #
I love all of your stories everyone. Thanks for sharing them.
Marnie September 19th, 2007 at 11:50 pm #
Art Harris is trash and way past his prime. From emmy winner to “special correspondent” for tabloid shows? And he’s so self promoting. His blog just screams LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME. And now hes doing stuff on hookers………and Howard, STILL, and OJ, STILL. His social relevance is zero. and in that respect, he’s no better than Rita Cosby, and even less important than Bugs Bunny in the big picture. No one’s gonna look back twenty years from now and talk about anything he wrote.
You either Jane. Who the hell would spend that much time writing this blog for no payback? If you were really any good, to more than the five or six people who post here you wouldn’t be here doing this.At least Harris gets paid for what he does.
Too bad this opinion won’t make it on your site, but out of pity I’ll click a ad before I go!
VIVIAN September 20th, 2007 at 3:22 am #
quote ” I would urge the idealists left in this world to stand up. Be brave and bold in your goodness, and step away from those who would challenge it for the sake of sport”. why do some have to ruin a beautiful link, so i just don’t want to ruin it by even comenting on a post or 2 ,I think are demeaning. They have no right. You do and say what is in your heart. and what and how you write shows a loving kind heart, Pity the ones full of meanness and rage.but do not condone it. They are wrong to come here , and be dis respectfull to you.
mish September 20th, 2007 at 8:32 am #
Thank you for posting that for me Jane. I didnt know it came from that site. I got it somewhere else(Author unknown) and beautiful none the less.
Vivian
Ignore them, if you ignore they are not heard. ~Mish 9/20/07
Montana Man
EVERYDAY id Mothers day!!!
Barbara September 20th, 2007 at 8:38 am #
Hey Marnie, whatever. I don’t know what you do with your life and I don’t care, but somehow I really doubt you’ve put yourself out there like Jane has, to help other people and to endure all the other crap that goes with being on the internet. And
I don’t read/watch Art Harris, but I seriously doubt he cares what your opinion about him his!
And Freida, seriously…..what the heck is wrong with you? So WHAT if Jane put ads on her site? MOST blogs have ads. Jane MIGHT make enough to pay to host the site. WHY WOULD PEOPLE BEGRUDGE HER EVEN THAT????? Good God, I can’t believe the audacity of some people! If Jane were to make a MILLION dollars from her work, I’d be HAPPY for her! Yet other people seem to feel that if she makes as much as a single penny, she’s somehow selling out. To what? The ability to do work that pays for itself?
Seriously, that attitude sucks.
Jane, I can’t wait to buy your book. (And I will buy it because unlike others I don’t believe you should give away everything for free!) Will you give us a hint what it’s about?
Alison September 20th, 2007 at 9:00 am #
Marnie,
I am never adverse to worthy criticism. I also don’t think respect should be accorded to those whose actions or public disseminations don’t deserve it. That said, I happen to agree completely with your assessment of Art Harris.
To extend your condemnation to include this site, whether for content or quality, is so unfounded in reality that it leaves the reader wondering what the heck that drive-by shooting was all about. The hostility in the tone of your words left me focusing not on your commentary, but on the type of person who would write such a thing about a woman whose thoughts and deeds are so clearly good-hearted.
The people that come to this site, whether to just read or to participate, do so because of the atmosphere that is generated by Jane’s writings. Whether it’s her creative pieces, her investigative articles or her personal comments to responders, there is a palpable sensitivity that makes it a welcoming sanctuary. We can be moved, motivated or entertained, but it’s always a positive experience. I’m only sorry that it eluded you.
Joni September 20th, 2007 at 9:20 am #
Jane,
Someone really reported your coffee fund to the IRS? How can anyone be that low? But then this is the internet and I’ve seen first hand of how low some people can be. It seems you just can’t win, no matter what. I’ve found out there are really mean and dispicable people out there. Please don’t let them get you down.
Montana Man,
That was cute what you posted about Mother’s Day. You have a good sense of humor and I think we can all benefit from more of that. Thanks.
Jane, Please keep up the good work. We all appreciate what you have done and are still doing. You are in the right, as always.
My mothers daughter September 20th, 2007 at 9:24 am #
Viv:
Atta go. Sorry Mish, I just can’t help myself.
Marnie:
If you find this site and Art Harris’s site so beneath you, then why are you at either site reading and posting? Just curious.
I happen to know for a fact the exact number of hits this site receives in the run of a day and it is certainly much greater than those who happen to post. There are many people in this world who want to read well written, articulate articles just for the shear enjoyment of it. Jane being the class act that she is, let your post through as she values all opinions.
Have you ever thought that Jane may be writing here just for the pure enjoyment of it and to share her God given gift? Jane Devin will not promote herself but I will. I happen to know that she has written two novels and ghost written another book. A previous article, “Cruelty is Not an Art” has been picked up by a newspaper. She is a well respected writer by her peers and has taken on subjects many wouldn’t touch, at the request of others, only to be used, abused, lied to and cast aside. Throughout it all, she has held her head up high and continued her writing.
This is the first site that I click on to each day when I turn on my computer and would be lost without it as would so many others. Jane’s articles make me think, which in my opinion, is the sign of a good writer.
My mother always taught me, if you don’t have anything nice to say, then don’t say anything. Sorry Mum, I tried to be polite but I couldn’t let that comment go unaddressed.
Marnie September 20th, 2007 at 11:50 am #
Wow, you people can’t read. I never said that Jane totally sucked as a writer only that she’d get PAID for it if she was as good as the few people here says she is. And the only reason she got popular at all, for five minutes, was because she got all the STERNIES to come read her stuff and they’d have read a bathroom wall if it was in support of Anna’s loyal sidekick!
And to Mother’s, I’ll go where I want, thanks! For now though I’ll bid your little click adieu, and go check out those cute swimsuits from DivaVillage so Jane doesn’t go broke paying that $10 month hosting charge!
Carla K September 20th, 2007 at 12:14 pm #
I really wish that someone would post the titles of the books that Jane has written. I would love to read more. Also, how come we can’t access QV’s site anymore? Thanx! Carla
Jane Devin September 20th, 2007 at 1:02 pm #
Thank you, Alison. I was speaking with a friend last night about feedback on the internet, and recalled the post you made on my author thread a few months ago. Your comments there, and here, continue to mean a lot to me.
Thank you, too, Barbara, MMD, Viv, Joni and Mish. (edited to add, thank you, too, A.P. We were posting at the same time.)
Slow day on TMZ, Marnie? Sorry to see you so lacking for attention that you had to bring your hostility here, but those kind of drive-by sticks and stones don’t really break my spirit, or the spirits of those who regularly post here.
Joni, yes, someone really did. Amazing, but at the same time kind of funny. It seems every neighborhood has at least one of those busybodies that peer through their window blinds waiting to call the authorities. The internet is just one big neighborhood, really.
Barbara, I try not to discuss works in progress too much, or frame them too tightly, because sometimes they take off in a direction other than what was originally intended. When I’m closer to the end, I’ll spill the beans.
Regarding Art Harris, I’ve had a spattering of experience with him. He reminds me of old Hollywood, Atlanta-style. He’s got a buttery Southern charm and a tinsel town style. Flowery compliments are never far from his lips, but his facts are squarely in his pocket. Personally, I found him to be charming. As far as his writing goes, it is what it is when it’s entertainment news. Articles often have to be written quickly, relay the facts, and be engaging. I think Art’s blog succeeds in doing that for the most part, although I do have a preference for his rarer, more passionate pieces. I don’t watch television often, so am largely unfamiliar with his work there. I also think my opinion about anything pertaining to Art Harris matters about as much as dollar on a deserted island.
Carla, the titles of my books were Orion Drifting (a novel) and The Myth of Exile (poetry). Neither were published, although I came pretty close with Orion. The book I ghostwrote had a working title of Hard, Fast & Cold, and it was the biography of a low-ranking money launderer for the mafia. Near the end of the year long project, I caught the would-be storyteller in a pack of lies. I dropped the project and am not sure what, if anything, he and his publisher ever did with the manuscript.
A.P. September 20th, 2007 at 1:14 pm #
Jane is not seeking fame or fortune, she has a passion for writing and we have a passion for reading her pieces. The readership extends far beyond those who post. As Alison and MMD pointed out there are many who are moved, motivated or entertained that do not post. I don’t understand the urge to ruin a beautiful thing for others.
As for a comparison in the quality of writing between Art and Jane. Jane is clearly the better writer. Marnie, if the subject matter is not your choice then I say “If you do not like the music, then change the station.”
Freida September 20th, 2007 at 1:47 pm #
Dear Jane,
What you wrote about Art Harris, was brilliant and tactful.
You would make a wonderful Diplomat.
I see no problem with the ads, they just came on all of a sudden, and rather disturbed the peace. Kinda like I do sometimes, LOL.
I did not report your coffee fund, in fact, I didn’t even call the police when I was ripped off last week. I did report the incident to Crimestoppers, though, so ‘they’ could harrass the little man that took my keepsakes and maybe protect the elderly that live in my neighborhood. I left messages for him, too, and told him I didn’t want him to lead a life of crime, and that, if he would only return my ‘things’ I would be glad to write him another check. If he had done that, he would have been a very lucky man.
VIVIAN September 20th, 2007 at 2:14 pm #
MARNIE, how does a woman come here and read the wonderful article on MOTHERS, and not have her mind go instantly to her own mother, and the times she remembers with her. And then to read all the lovings posts, that are so special, to each one of us that wrote them…. to see them become special to the other posters, and feel a bond between each of us because of being able to share. How is it that all you could do was to was find fault with what is happening here. Why didn’t you just post something about your memories of your mother, and enjoy them? This is very puzzling to me.
Barbara September 20th, 2007 at 2:44 pm #
I just have one other thought to share on this talent equals fame or money-making idea that Marnie expressed.
There are people who are superb cooks that never enter contests, write cookbooks or appear on tv programs. It does not make them less talented, or their food less tasty. And if they went head to head with a Rachel Ray or Emeril in a blind taste test, I have no doubt that many of these unknown chefs would topple their better-known counterparts.
Just because a person doesn’t manage to make a well paying career out of their passion doesn’t make them any less talented. There are singers and musicians that are extremely talented who will never see their name in lights at the concert hall. Many don’t even want that. They just have a passion for music. Others want it but fail to breakthrough, or can’t dedicate the time or money to “making it” but go on to share what they have with smaller groups.
There are many talented, wonderful people in the world. Just because they’re not on Tv or winning awards or getting big contracts doesn’t make them less than who they are. It doesn’t diminish their talents.
And Vivian, I agree with you.
Freida September 20th, 2007 at 3:04 pm #
My Mother was amazing.
She could tailor make a man’s suit, that could have been sold in the finest store. She could knit, crochet, tat, darn it…you name it…she could play any musical instrument, by ear…she could duplicate any recipe without measuring.
She could not tell time until she was much older, funny thing.
She took home-school courses, and earned her GED (although she had to lie, because she had only finished the 5th grade), she taught herself how to type, and I helped her with her Basic Math, Algebra, and Geometry.
My Mother was amazing.
Joni September 20th, 2007 at 3:04 pm #
Jane,
I was just thinking about your nemeses in NE, D and S. I’m wondering if one of them turned you in to the IRS. I certainly wouldn’t put it past either of them.
Joni September 20th, 2007 at 3:18 pm #
I hope this isn’t the same Marnie I “knew” from an old site I used to go to before I found this one and QV’s. The Marnie from the old site seemed like a very nice person, and that Marnie would never have said ANY of the things “this” Marnie said.
I’m wondering if “this Marnie” took the other Marnie’s name and came here. I pray that is the case, because if it is the same one, then she did a complete aboutface. I also know she was in Howard’s favor, which, “this” Marnie doesn’t seem to be. I can’t believe this can possibly the same one.
Joni September 20th, 2007 at 3:37 pm #
Okay, I just re-read Marnie’s posts and I’m getting the feeling that she is a he. Going by some of the words used, makes me think this is a man and IF it is, then it is not the Marnie I came in contact with before. If it is the same person, then they have taken on a whole new personality, totally opposite of the one I “knew”.
VIVIAN September 20th, 2007 at 4:20 pm #
Jonie , the negative posting of This Marnie, would make more sense being a man, one who has an issue with his mother, and has passed it on to women in general. Hope he i not married
Joni September 20th, 2007 at 5:20 pm #
Vivian,
Yes, after I read those posts a second time, I could see it could have easily been a man. As I stated before, the Marnie I knew, was very nice and would never have said anything this person said.
Lucky September 21st, 2007 at 12:11 am #
Jane,
I do not need to tell anyone here about your writing. It speaks for itsself. Your writing is very different than Art’s. They are not the same. If I want a good story, I come here to read. I have not been interested in some of them. While others I find very interesting. And NO, I would not turn you in to the IRS. Not my business. I do not agree or would never give a total stranger money in any way shape or form. Nada, nope. But if others do, well that’s what they want. To ask for money is not acceptable to me. But again, that is just my opinion. People forget that difference in opinion is a good thing. As long as it is kept in good taste.
To the rest of you who obviously do not know the difference. I do not feel it necessary to bash Art’s writing or to put him down. To my knowledge he has never done the same to any of you here. You are doing the very same, as has been done to you before. You are bashing others for talking to Jane in the same manner you are talking about Art. Art and Jane are different writers. Jane telling stories with compasion and Art keeping everyone up to date on the latest going on in the news. He is not writing a fictional novel or writing poems, or stories. He is posting the updates.
So get a grip on yourselves. Looking at who’s site has more posters and on what subject. Give me a break. Some stories have alot more postings than others. That’s a clue! Obviously the Anna and Howard story still has ALOT of following. So if your keeping up then you know that other stories are not the same hits as others. Some sites have shut down for this very same reason. Posters go some where else where there is none of this bashing and name calling going on.
Good luck to all
Freida September 21st, 2007 at 12:33 am #
Well, Lucky,
I said that Jane was brilliant and tactful, when she wrote about Art Harris.
Personally I think he writes more by the seat of his pants, more like a reporter, and more from his gut, where as, Jane writes from her heart.
In other words, Art writes like a guy!
And, I happen to appreciate many writing styles, it’s like listening to music.
Good Luck back.
By the way, Jane, I still have you filed under Literature/Review.
Art Harris is in another folder.
I have you both bookmarked!!!
Barbara September 21st, 2007 at 5:27 am #
Lucky, I don’t even know how the subject of AH got brought up but I’d agree that it’s not appropriate to bash here, Especially in a thread that started off so beautifully! I do want to say though that I don’t fill that anyone who provides a free service is out of line for accepting donations, and quite a few websites that offer free software or web art do the same. And Jane to the best of my knowledge has never asked anyone to contribute. That link just sits there for people to do or not as they please. And you know, for me, sending $5 or $10 here for something I enjoy reading is less expensive than subscribing to a magazine or buyiing a book, (who are even more perfect strangers when you think about it) but you are right, it’s an individual choice and totally voluntary. My point is it’s not asked for. The ability just exists. People can think what they will of it, as they do the content, the ads, and each other.
Some stories are more popular than others, for sure. And people bring different gifts and ideas to the table. Message boards are all over the internet and each one is different, with a different tone and general attitude.
I don’t like that Jane’s site is often viewed through the lens of what her readers have to say rather than what she says in her own words, and find it kind of weird actually that that has happened here, in a way that doesn’t seem to happen on other sites. I think it may be because of the popularity of the Anna story. People were either “for or against” and neutral didn’t really exist. It seems to me that arguments and people from those days get carried over and still fuel a lot of ill will. I think its silly for people to abandon a site because of what other posters say. Ignore the comments you don’t want to respond to or respond with your own views. It’s not as if one or two bashers rule the roost, and to accord them that kind of power, and abandon everything else, is really shortsighted. I think it’s unfortunate, too, as Jane has moved past that story and on to other things.
Freida September 21st, 2007 at 7:36 am #
I didn’t grow up with white gloves or black purses, however my daughter did, and she could have cared less.
What she mostly craved was my time, and attention, my approval, my hugs and kisses, and those intimate bedtime talks…and reading…and what we talked about after we closed the books…and then I would ‘trace her face’…with my hands I would gently outline her facial features…and squeeze her little nose, then we would sing “Amazing Grace,” or rather I would…quietly, softly..as she closed her eyes and I would gently continue…’til she was almost asleep…she still asks me to ‘trace her face,’ to this day.
Watch me mommy, see what I can do?
And, I applaud, every new step she takes.
Karissa September 21st, 2007 at 7:20 pm #
Freida, that was beautiful. Thanks for sharing that.
VIVIAN September 21st, 2007 at 7:48 pm #
The only one bashing is Marnie, and he or she bashed both Art and Jane. I think the posters were sticking up for both of them. Jane and Art should not be compared at all — two different people and two different types of articles. As far as Art having more posters, well yeah — he’s been on the internet much longer, and he’s on TV, and pretty well-known. Many posters respond to the Howard/Larry stories, and it remains a very popular news story .
Lucky September 21st, 2007 at 9:55 pm #
Freida, I agree with what you said 100%. Good luck to you always.
Barbara, I came to Jane and Art’s defense too. If a poster annoys me, I usually ignore them and they go away when they get bored. Like I said on the coffee fund, to each his own. That was my personal view.
MMD, I tell my sons the same story. It was from the movie Bambi, Thumper (the rabbit) said it. If you can’t say anything nice, don’t say anything at all.
Joni September 22nd, 2007 at 3:03 pm #
Barbara,
I hope you weren’t referring to all of us readers when you said, ” I don’t like that Jane’s is often viewed through the lens of what her readers have to say, rather than what she has to say.
Barbara September 22nd, 2007 at 3:32 pm #
Dear Joni,
No, no…..that’s not what I was thinking when I wrote that though I can see how it looks now that you reprinted it, LOL. No, I was thinking about how someone says something that might be controversial, or negative, or has an opinion that others would strongly disagree with. It’s not happening so much now but when she was writing about Howard it seemed aome people left the board because of what other posters said and somehow those thoughts that were expressed by others became attributed to jane on other forums. I remember courtTV’s board had a quote on their board that they were saying she said, but it was actually from a poster and it wasn’t a good thing. That was what I meant. Sorry I wasn’t clearer!
Barb
Joni September 22nd, 2007 at 8:36 pm #
LOL Barbara. Thanks for making it clearer to me. I sometimes tend to take a different meaning out of something than what was intended. I understand now, what you meant.
Laws October 3rd, 2007 at 12:33 am #
Thank you Jane for your writings. Your articles are lovely.
Do wish that you would either not show the inappropriate comments or have a separate section for the “nasties” AKA “bullies”. Allowing their comments to distract from the subjects at hand as well as reversing the positive energy that is here on your site of sharing & searching in a pleasant manner. Displaying “nasties” postings encourages these horrible writings. IMO, these are people who are so in need of attention this is the method they guarantee themselves a response. Oftentimes, it is my feeling that this is what is unravelling our communities, this is greatly responsible for the growing apathy that we are seeing all around us.
Our world is so busy, the majority of us are searching for comfortable places to spend our time where we encounter others who are open & yearning for others points of view & experiences to enrich our human experiences. Experiences that give us joy, hope & belief in ourselves & others. That life with its ups & downs is enlightening.